Kit & Tab quick questions thread

[Neil.]

then i've to step and touch. I'd rather just a touch ().

 

what if i was to basically make a box like this:

In> Buffer > FX Loop (copied from something like a marshall) > Buffer > Out

[Dramatic Hammer]

then i've to step and touch. I'd rather just a touch ().

 

what if i was to basically make a box like this:

In> Buffer > FX Loop (copied from something like a marshall) > Buffer > Out

 

A simple buffer with enough gain to bring it up to line level then a pull-down voltage divider would do it imo

[Neil.]

cool. I'll try that jon.

 

what about those FX Loop type peddles?

[cheddatom]

if you just boost your signal to line level at the end of your chain, before the KP it should be fine. But then you have to reduce the gain on your amp and any other shit you put after the KP.

[Phill]

if you just boost your signal to line level at the end of your chain, before the KP it should be fine. But then you have to reduce the gain on your amp and any other shit you put after the KP.

 

I can't picture that leaving your tone particularly intact though. New amp with FX loop!

[cheddatom]

why? You can get very clean boosters.

[Neil.]

if you just boost your signal to line level at the end of your chain, before the KP it should be fine. But then you have to reduce the gain on your amp and any other shit you put after the KP.

 

How much boost are we talking about? Like would something like an MXR Microamp or an EHX LPB1 do it?

 

I can't picture that leaving your tone particularly intact though. New amp with FX loop!

 

I wish...

[Phill]

why? You can get very clean boosters.

 

I just picture boosting up to line level then reducing it right back down isn't going to leave a very good signal, let alone any dynamics.

[cheddatom]

How much boost are we talking about? Like would something like an MXR Microamp or an EHX LPB1 do it?

 

Yeh but they're not the cleanest (apparently). You could use a DI box with output control.

 

I just picture boosting up to line level then reducing it right back down isn't going to leave a very good signal, let alone any dynamics.

 

I didn't mean to reduce it down after, although you'd have to do that if you have pedals after the KP.

[Phill]

Yeh but they're not the cleanest (apparently). You could use a DI box with output control.

 

 

 

I didn't mean to reduce it down after, although you'd have to do that if you have pedals after the KP.

 

Actually I have run an iPod into a guitar amp and had that sound alright.

[Neil.]

tom, i know it's behringer, but what about this, except in reverse:

http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/DI400P.aspx

[cheddatom]

Well that wouldn't give you a level boost. You really need a DI box with a pre-amp in, or just a booster pedal. I'm sure you could find a schem for a clean boost.

 

Having said that i've re-read your initial post and it sounds like the input to the KP might be too high, therefore driving whatever limiting it has going on, reducing your dynamics.

 

Why would a low input to a KP result in a loss of dynamic range? It doesn't make sense.

 

I know the KP operates at line level though, so.....

[Neil.]

this is confusing me now... I'll go to my 3 hours of law lectures and figure it out later.

[Neil.]

Ok, so, after severe levels of boredom, a DI box with a preamp in it would do the trick, right?

[Don'tPostThePear]

Ok, so, after severe levels of boredom,

 

you were quite fast.

 

i hate uni, i can't play guitar in the flat, only unplugged.

 

i think my next build/purchase will be something what could make my guitar usable with a headphone.

[cheddatom]

Ok, so, after severe levels of boredom, a DI box with a preamp in it would do the trick, right?

 

What i'm saying is that you're getting a reduction in dynamics (apparently) which is compression. Compression could come from a limiting circuit in the KP. If you turn down the input gain, (IE on your guitar volume knob) does it increase the dynamic range? Similarly the KP could be overdriving your amp, although I think you'd notice that.

 

If none of that works then it must be to do with how the AD converter in the KP works. I suppose you need a decent level signal to sample properly. If you have a distortion peddle you can set up as a clean boost, try that before you spend money.

[Neil.]

i wasn't going to spend money, i was just going to build something. i'll try to give as much details on before/after. The problems and such.

 

Before:

Firstly, there's good balance between treb, mid, bass. Any adjustments i make on my guitar or amp are noticible. On my peddles, if i adjust tone, it only comes into effect when that peddle is on (eg, if i have lots of bass on my muff, when i turn it on, it'll sound really bassey. simples.). All the volumes on the effects are more or less the same (all at about 9-11 oclock).

 

After:

Most noticible, complete lack of mids and low ends. All the volumes are fucked. I've to readjust firstly the amp volume, and tonestack from a clean signal, then go through each peddle and do the same with/without them engaged. Funny things happen with OD's and Fuzz's. For example, there's NO oscilating on the FF, which, by the way, sounds great in theory, but fuzz sounds then are shit. It's impossible to get a SMBH type sound out of it. With OD's, they lose most of their clipping. The Jackhammer won't clip at all, and when the DV does clip, it sounds gated, and the limit light on the KP comes on.

 

I do like the KP, even if it is just for making silly intro type noises. It's bit of a laugh, and i'd rather not take it out if i could have it with something like a reamp type box.

[cheddatom]

What's it like with just your guitar into the KP into the amp?

 

The FF should work the same as long as it's before the KP in the chain.

 

The KP should have no effect on the tone when it's bypassed. I've never used one, do you need to check some settings?

 

If you have an EQ pedal, try that as a boost, just guitar->boost->KP->amp. If no EQ, try the jackhammer with almost no gain.

 

Most pedals can get you somewhere near a decent line level EG my pedalboard into the FX return or poweramp input sounds fine.

[Neil.]

I think i'll take it out till i get/build a DI. From looking about on the interweb, i think i'm right in saying i can bring it from Line Level to Instrument Level with a DI Box, so, i can do without it till then.

[cheddatom]

DI box takes instrument and changes to line level.

[Neil.]

you can run them backwards if you set the level to 20db for line to instrument.

[cheddatom]

what so you're going to run one backwards after the KP? Then the input to the KP will still be instrument level.

[Neil.]

Not exactly. The theory is to sort of make a 2DI-in-1 box. It'll go Input> DI stage 1: Instrument to Line > KP Input > KP Output > DI Stage 2: Line to Instrument > Output.

 

So when you look at the box, it'll have an input, a "Loop" and an output.

 

That's the theory, but it's usually around now when phill or james will jump in and explain why thaat'll wreck my toanz!

 

edit

This would also do it: http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/DI20.aspx

[Don'tPostThePear]

Not exactly. The theory is to sort of make a 2DI-in-1 box. It'll go Input> DI stage 1: Instrument to Line > KP Input > KP Output > DI Stage 2: Line to Instrument > Output.

 

So when you look at the box, it'll have an input, a "Loop" and an output.

 

That's the theory, but it's usually around now when phill or james will jump in and explain why thaat'll wreck my toanz!

 

edit

This would also do it: http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/DI20.aspx

 

Line to instrument level "conversion" is just a voltage divider pot imo. You set up its output volume to the same setting as if only the guitar would be plugged in.

[Neil.]

in what way? just a passive volume control before or after the KP??