Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Remember when Muse use to have singles like "New Born", "Stockholm Syndrome", "Hysteria"? IMHO the rot began with "Time is Running Out" - their first explicit pop song. They never should have done it in retrospect. It gave them chart success and the taste of filthy lucre. You cited two songs from Abso as great singles from their glory days, then a third from Abso as the start of "the rot." You realize those were all written and released around the same time, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoledman Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 The problem is Dig Down is literally Madness redux. Right down to the chord progression and vocal style. Madness itself was a George Michael "Faith" ripoff. Welcome back to 1987! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Nah, I think they still love being a rock band at heart. They practically live for moshing crowds and you can tell from interviews and behind-the-scenes stuff that they're still very much into their riffs. The real pop-y stuff over the last 10 years has always been more of an excursion imo, the odd couple or few per album (Supermassive/Starlight, UD/IBTY, Madness/Follow Me/Panic, Dead Inside/Mercy/Revolt). It's just that those taking up the majority of the singles in that time means that that's the side they've established themselves as to a lot of people which, in turn, is probs what makes Matt feel compelled to put them in the set. If I didn't know who Muse was aside from Madness and Uprising, and I went to a show on a whim with a friend, and the whole set was OoS and Abso era stuff, I'd be pretty disappointed and confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 The problem is Dig Down is literally Madness redux. Right down to the chord progression and vocal style. Madness itself was a George Michael "Faith" ripoff. Welcome back to 1987! The song structure isn't quite the same though, and neither are the melodies (between the Muse songs), so I'd hardly call them the same song. The synth-bass is slightly different in tone and rhythm as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoledman Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 You cited two songs from Abso as great singles from their glory days, then a third from Abso as the start of "the rot." You realize those were all written and released around the same time, right? Yeah I realize that, but in 2002-2003 Matt wasn't obsessed with writing pop songs. He did TIRO more as an experiment to see if he could rather than indicating that as a change in direction. Unfortunately it really was as evidenced by "Starlight", "Supermassive Black Hole", "Invincible" on the next album. Hell, 70% of the LP 5/6/7 are pop songs. 'Member when there used to be songs like "Falling Away With You", "Screenager", "Shrinking Universe", "Ruled by Secrecy", "Citizen Erased"? The problem is Muse understood 10 years ago that if they wrote more pop songs, they would make more money. Essentially they did what The Moody Blues did in the 1980s, sold out and made tons of money. "Your Wildest Dreams"... I personally discovered the band via "Butterflies & Hurricanes", that was my gateway drug to Muse. Not pop crap. At least with Radiohead, if you're 15 and the first thing you ever heard was "Burn the Witch", you didn't get robbed of artistry on the first go. "A Moon Shaped Pool" isn't Kid A/Amnesiac but it's a damn fine progressive art-rock album that shows you don't have to sell out at 40+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Yeah I realize that, but in 2002-2003 Matt wasn't obsessed with writing pop songs. He did TIRO more as an experiment to see if he could rather than indicating that as a change in direction. Unfortunately it really was as evidenced by "Starlight", "Supermassive Black Hole", "Invincible" on the next album. Hell, 70% of the LP 5/6/7 are pop songs. 'Member when there used to be songs like "Falling Away With You", "Screenager", "Shrinking Universe", "Ruled by Secrecy", "Citizen Erased"? The problem is Muse understood 10 years ago that if they wrote more pop songs, they would make more money. Essentially they did what The Moody Blues did in the 1980s, sold out and made tons of money. "Your Wildest Dreams"... I personally discovered the band via "Butterflies & Hurricanes", that was my gateway drug to Muse. Not pop crap. I'd hardly call any album with Exogenesis, Isolated System, or The Globalist on it a sell-out release. Imo BH&R was their most commercial album, though TR and T2L were more successful with bigger singles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoledman Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 I'd hardly call any album with Exogenesis, Isolated System, or The Globalist on it a sell-out release. Imo BH&R was their most commercial album, though TR and T2L were more successful with bigger singles. It just irritates the hell out of me that Matt is chasing Chris Martin instead of the other way around like in the early 2000s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 It just irritates the hell out of me that Matt is chasing Chris Martin instead of the other way around like in the early 2000s. If Matt were chasing Chris Martin, he'd be getting Rihanna and Beyonce to guest star on Muse songs, and he'd give up all the crazy conspiracy theories for generic and generalized lovesick stuff that comprises most of Chris' lyrics. Actually, when Matt does write love songs, they tend to have some of his best lyrics...maybe he should do more of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoledman Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 If Matt were chasing Chris Martin, he'd be getting Rihanna and Beyonce to guest star on Muse songs, and he'd give up all the crazy conspiracy theories for generic and generalized lovesick stuff that comprises most of Chris' lyrics. Actually, when Matt does write love songs, they tend to have some of his best lyrics...maybe he should do more of that. Muse are one of the highest grossing rock acts in the last 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Muse are one of the highest grossing rock acts in the last 5 years. Modern musicians make the vast majority of their income from touring, not record sales. Muse could never release another song and still be one of those highest grossing acts for the next 5 years I bet. They are widely known as one of THE top live bands, and they're one of the youngest of that top tier as well, what with artists like Springsteen and U2 in there. That said, Coldplay are also amazing live, actually better than on record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smoledman Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Modern musicians make the vast majority of their income from touring, not record sales. Muse could never release another song and still be one of those highest grossing acts for the next 5 years I bet. They are widely known as one of THE top live bands, and they're one of the youngest of that top tier as well, what with artists like Springsteen and U2 in there. That said, Coldplay are also amazing live, actually better than on record. Muse are all turning 40 in the next 18 months, so they are quite the 'junior' in comparison to many of the other major high revenue acts like the Stones, Springsteen. Hard to imagine Matt/Dom/Chris as 40, I always thought they'd be 22 forever like this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobby Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Hell, 70% of the LP 5/6/7 are pop songs. TR: Resistance, Undisclosed Desires, I Belong To You (3/11) T2L: Madness, Panic Station, Follow Me, Big Freeze (4/12) Drones: Dead Inside, Mercy, Revolt (3/10) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 TR: Resistance, Undisclosed Desires, I Belong To You (3/11) T2L: Madness, Panic Station, Follow Me, Big Freeze (4/12) Drones: Dead Inside, Mercy, Revolt (3/10) lol, and Panic Station and IBTY are at least a bit of a stretch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurkinglurkerlurksagain Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 It seems like whenever Muse release a pop single, it's "the band has sold out!" Well, a lot of people can get dragged in by hearing one of their pop songs, then digging into their catalog. I mean, hell, found them through American Idol, and they quickly became my favorite band as soon as I listened to Absolution and Origin of Symmetry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bohemian-Cygnus-Running-Out Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 It seems like whenever Muse release a pop single, it's "the band has sold out!" Well, a lot of people can get dragged in by hearing one of their pop songs, then digging into their catalog. I mean, hell, found them through American Idol, and they quickly became my favorite band as soon as I listened to Absolution and Origin of Symmetry. TiRO, Uprising, SMBH, Madness, and Starlight all helped real me in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iLikeCorvettes Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 It seems like whenever Muse release a pop single, it's "the band has sold out!" Well, a lot of people can get dragged in by hearing one of their pop songs, then digging into their catalog. I mean, hell, found them through American Idol, and they quickly became my favorite band as soon as I listened to Absolution and Origin of Symmetry. Same. First song I heard was SMBH on FIFA. Then TIRO and Uprising. And then around the time Drones came out I listened to that and decided to look into them more. Started from the beginning with showbiz, OoS, etc... I'd say I'm a pretty big fan now (not as much as most of y'all but still) and I only got into them because of their "pop" songs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bumpypotato Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 No. Just... no. If it must come down to this, then I prefer to keep shamelessly 80s-influenced Muse, thank you. Why? At least Radiohead are still writing genuinely interesting music, not just trend hopping like Matt. - new album influenced by "burning man festival", many songs with EBM elements and Hiphop beats Ah shit. Hell, in my honest opinion he is the best lyricist alive. Not trying to be that guy, but no. As lurker said, the likes of Kendrick, Nick Cave and Darnielle could speak circles around him. Not that it matters, since in the case of Matt his lyrics are so bad that all other comparisons are immediately pointless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudia O Posted May 20, 2017 Author Share Posted May 20, 2017 (edited) The problem is Dig Down is literally Madness redux. Right down to the chord progression and vocal style. Madness itself was a George Michael "Faith" ripoff. Welcome back to 1987! Wait wait wait...as a longtime fan of George, I never heard "Faith" in Madness! Why do you think so? But, as I first heard "Dig down" it was clear to hear the part from "Freedom" in it: "Freedom,freedom,freedom you gotta give for what you take!" in Dig down it is "dig down, dig down, dig down and find Faith!" also the "gospel" part reminded me of George Michael and his eycellent backing singers. Cause he's recently died, it may be a reason for me to dislike the song, and to know George's Freedom is way better. There is an interview with one of the Sex Pistols, he asked Matt about the George Michael reference in the song, and Matt said "Always love a bit of George. Yeah, He's always find his way in somewhere." Edited May 20, 2017 by Claudia O. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clunge Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Muse's albumly 'songs a bit like this' history: Endlessly Map Of The Problematique Undisclosed Desires Madness Dead Inside Dig Down :'( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odier Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Funny, I remember what all of you said when DI was released haha :LOL: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That_Italian_Guy Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Funny, I remember what all of you said when DI was released haha :LOL: It was all down to expectations, the song was the opener of the album, with a dark title, everybody thought it would be Stockholm Syndrome/Dead Star 2.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Funny, I remember what all of you said when DI was released haha :LOL: All of us? I loved it the first time I heard it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frozenbanana Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 (edited) It's quite sad in retrospect that SMBH probably felt like a big 'fuck you and goodbye' to the Muse of OOS and Absolution (and was treated as such by a lot of fans) at the time, but as Muse pop-ish chart material goes, it's far heavier (and a far better song) than most of what has come since. It's still their most accomplished crossover song imho. EDIT: oh, and Turner's lyrics are a bit overrated, and AM is MASSIVELY overrated - a third of the album is just the same song played at different speeds with tiny melody variations (One for the Road, Knee Socks, Arabella, WYOCMWYH) Edited May 20, 2017 by frozenbanana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartianSpaghettiRider Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Why? At least Radiohead are still writing genuinely interesting music, not just trend hopping like Muse. Because I don't want to hear that goddamn claim that "Muse copied Radiohead1!1!" anymore. They moved their first step by getting panned on this baseless evidence with Showbiz. It would be like overshadowing them again. I prefer them to stay on separate dimensions, and that's it. Muse as a more viable band that like to play around some pop influences, and Radiohead as a perfect example of a band that are successful whilst experimenting properly a lot. And... "trend hopping"? They would make music like Imagine Dragons and such if they were doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FabriPav Posted May 20, 2017 Share Posted May 20, 2017 Maybe we can expect like a Radiohead's amnesiac.Why not? Because Amnesiac is a good album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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