Witz Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Yeah I agree with the Sippe guy So do I,the Sign o the times was amazing and a studio version would be great as the guitar tone on that track is epic, the falsetto near the end was pretty amazing as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdrunner95 Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Tom doesn't need a reminder to troll the fanbase. I think that's in his job description. I think that's a racial slur, too, btw... Not sure if you were aware. nah you're thinking of jap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 nah you're thinking of jap No she isn't. It's about the Romani people, not the Japanese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdrunner95 Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 No she isn't. It's about the Romani people, not the Japanese. That's gyp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 That's gyp. Same meaning and origin, different spelling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneonfish Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Gyp isn't racist. At least, not directly imo. It doesn't refer to the people, it means to steal. I think it can also mean pain. Add an O on the end and you've got a racist term though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Gyp isn't racist. At least, not directly imo. It doesn't refer to the people, it means to steal. I think it can also mean pain. Add an O on the end and you've got a racist term though. That's the problem though. It's widely believed to derive from the word gypsy, and it means to steal or cheat. Doesn't get more obvious than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serpentsatellite Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 It's based out of the stereotype that the Romani made a living stealing and cheating other people. It's referring to a bad act using the people as an example of the bad act. All I know, is we weren't allowed to use it in school when I was a kid, but my teacher referred to our one black student as a "negro." Oh, and some guy I used to work with got insta-fired for using it during a transaction with a client. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneonfish Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 That's the problem though. It's widely believed to derive from the word gypsy, and it means to steal or cheat. Doesn't get more obvious than that. Yeah, of course. I don't think it's a racist word though because you're not directly referring to the people even though they're its derivation. Anyway, I suppose a semantisc arguments brings the thread back full circle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Yeah, of course. I don't think it's a racist word though because you're not directly referring to the people even though they're its derivation. Anyway, I suppose a semantisc arguments brings the thread back full circle. Then you're quite simply wrong. It's a word that was probably created in order to describe the actions of a group of people based on stereotypes, and it literally uses a verb form of the word. Much like the discussion we had a week ago, where it doesn't matter if you're not referring to a homosexual when using fag or faggot as a derogatory term. To argue against that is ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamCee Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Did anyone see the email Muse sent out? Confirmed producer and surprise near Christmas! EDIT: Apparently producer was already confirmed... Didn't know. My guess is there's going to be doing a few dates in Japan tbh Really want them to do a few gigs in England that aren't festivals. Would kill to go to Download but unable to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LewisF Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 My guess is there's going to be doing a few dates in Japan tbh Really want them to do a few gigs in England that aren't festivals. Would kill to go to Download but unable to. Pretty sure they'll come to England, they've never been known not to on a select tour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonisdead Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 I loathe political correctness. I didn't even know the word's etymological origins and its frequent use in the form "jip" certainly don't beg an education about the oppression the Romani people face. It's a common colloquial phrase in the US, there is nothing offensive about the word. Using "gyp" implies a desire to make racial/stereotypical reference, if anything the origins of that form are offensive, but I assure you rarely anyone in the US is aware that "jip" has those associations. Most don't care EDIT: For the record, I said "jip," not "gyp." The word "gyp" and its connotation was brought into the discussion by another poster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FabriPav Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 This has nothing to do with political correctness. Most don't care that's the problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee3Dee Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 rarely anyone in the US is aware Sounds about right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneonfish Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Then you're quite simply wrong. It's a word that was probably created in order to describe the actions of a group of people based on stereotypes, and it literally uses a verb form of the word. Much like the discussion we had a week ago, where it doesn't matter if you're not referring to a homosexual when using fag or faggot as a derogatory term. To argue against that is ridiculous. Yeah, you're right. I'm wrong, sorry. I looked it up in the OED just to be completely sure. Apparently the cheat/swindle meaning is more common in US English than in British English which obviously isn't a defence for my ignorance/stupidity. Gyp meaning pain/hurt apparently comes from gee-up which seems odd. Anyway, whatever, I was completely wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneonfish Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 I loathe political correctness. I didn't even know the word's etymological origins and its frequent use in the form "jip" certainly don't beg an education about the oppression the Romani people face. It's a common colloquial phrase in the US, there is nothing offensive about the word. Using "gyp" implies a desire to make racial/stereotypical reference, if anything the origins of that form are offensive, but I assure you rarely anyone in the US is aware that "jip" has those associations. Most don't care EDIT: For the record, I said "jip," not "gyp." The word "gyp" and its connotation was brought into the discussion by another poster Jip is a misspelling of gyp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonisdead Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Jip is a misspelling of gyp. No, it's an alternate form. Look it up. "Verb[edit] jip (third-person singular simple present jips, present participle jipping, simple past and past participle jipped) Alternative form of gyp" http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/jip Regardless, culture in the US is different from European culture and as such neither is more correct than the other. People in the US are commonly thought to be/viewed as less proper than people from England, and they hold their opinions highly. For this reason I dislike political correctness because it's someone taking offense to the expression of another, more often than not it hones in on extreme minutia and ignorance/misunderstanding of cultural variation (as is happening now, slang differs from country to country and slang doesn't always intend to imply offense against a group but rather convey the connotation of the word, in this case: "to be robbed") rather than genuine hate-speech. When people become more afraid of offending others with their expression than they value expressing themselves, we will become too afraid of imparting anything lest we offend anyone. It's a rampant problem in the US and I'm not sure how aware Europeans are of the extremely hyper-PC culture in America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 I loathe political correctness. I didn't even know the word's etymological origins and its frequent use in the form "jip" certainly don't beg an education about the oppression the Romani people face. It's a common colloquial phrase in the US, there is nothing offensive about the word. Using "gyp" implies a desire to make racial/stereotypical reference, if anything the origins of that form are offensive, but I assure you rarely anyone in the US is aware that "jip" has those associations. Most don't care EDIT: For the record, I said "jip," not "gyp." The word "gyp" and its connotation was brought into the discussion by another poster "I hate having to think before I speak to make sure that I don't offend people" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FabriPav Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 No, it's an alternate form. Look it up. "Verb[edit] jip (third-person singular simple present jips, present participle jipping, simple past and past participle jipped) Alternative form of gyp" http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/jip Regardless, culture in the US is different from European culture and as such neither is more correct than the other. People in the US are commonly thought to be/viewed as less proper than people from England, and they hold their opinions highly. For this reason I dislike political correctness because it's someone taking offense to the expression of another, more often than not it hones in on extreme minutia and ignorance/misunderstanding of cultural variation (as is happening now, slang differs from country to country and slang doesn't always intend to imply offense against a group but rather convey the connotation of the word, in this case: "to be robbed") rather than genuine hate-speech. When people become more afraid of offending others with their expression than they value expressing themselves, we will become too afraid of imparting anything lest we offend anyone. It's a rampant problem in the US and I'm not sure how aware Europeans are of the extremely hyper-PC culture in America. What a load of horseshit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hat Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 "slang doesn't always intend to imply offense against a group but rather convey the connotation of the word" ie racist prejudice. "I associate gypsies with stealing and cheating, so therefore gyp will mean to steal and cheat...but it's not racism! Quit being so politically correct!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Citizen_Eraser Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 More songs. This. And also it seems whenever Muse thinks something isn't good enough for the album it turns out to be one of the best songs they've ever done. Like Fury, Glorious, etc. Theres way more I could list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serpentsatellite Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Sounds about right. JJ hardly personifies Americans. However, you do have a point, and I would be hard pressed to argue against it... *sigh* I also find people who are upset about this apparently "hyper PC America" problem tend to be white males. Things are actually still a bit shit for the rest of us due to things we were born into, and call it "sensitivity" or "empathy." That said, "jip" has been seen as offensive in the US since I was a kid, and that was kind of a hell of a long time ago. It is NOT "commonly used" - at least not in any areas I've lived or worked in, which are many. Maybe in the circles of people who use the f-word and the r-word, because "boo, political correctness"... Anyways I'd still like to know why Glorious wasn't included in the album. The chance to get that live, even as a rarity, or at least a good video of it, would have made my decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanp16 Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 oh .mu board, never change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con101 Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 Wow people post legitimate thoughts or speculation about the album in the previous pages and they are shot down. But hell argue about the semantics of a throwaway comment 'til the cows come home. Besides, gypsies do cheat, they cheat the taxation system. They also cheat land-owners out of rent they duly owe. That's not racist, that's just fact. Gypsies have set up camp in my hometown on 4 occasions. On each occasion houses were robbed. Bear in mind this is a town with a population of 2000 give or take and these things just don't happen. So a good deal of them steal too, from my experience. The only reason words like Gyp or Gypo are deemed derogatory is because of things like this, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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