Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 At the risk presenting as a NOOOOOB, I was wondering if there has been any discussion regarding the techniques used to crack mirror perspex? Does anybody know how it's possible to crack it with a tight bunch of cracks as seen in the centre of the original Laser Manson? Or is it just jump on it and hope???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Apparently they did the laser by jumping on it, but they've done it two other ways from what I understand Currently they use these custom tools (no idea what), but before that, it was putting the mirror in a vice...and hoping it doesn't explode everywhere This one was my favorite - I read a while back that they froze it and then cracked it in a vice. Not sure if the part about freezing is actually true or not, though I think Phill hit his with a hammer, but I don't know if he had to go through several sheets to get a good one. The vice seems dangerous, and it doesn't always come out looking great (assuming it doesn't explode) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Ah man I've gone through so much perspex trying to figure out those shatters. The closest I could get was bending it backwards until it explodes and then piecing all the bits back together again. Not fun and not quite the same. You can get "controlled" cracked with a rubber mallet, but they aren't that controlled and it's not easy still to get something that comes out looking good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 Apparently they did the laser by jumping on it, but they've done it two other ways from what I understand Currently they use these custom tools (no idea what), but before that, it was putting the mirror in a vice...and hoping it doesn't explode everywhere This one was my favorite - I read a while back that they froze it and then cracked it in a vice. Not sure if the part about freezing is actually true or not, though I think Phill hit his with a hammer, but I don't know if he had to go through several sheets to get a good one. The vice seems dangerous, and it doesn't always come out looking great (assuming it doesn't explode) Now that is a beautiful looking guitar, something i'd love to be able to replicate. I think it's unlikely that they'd be able to get the perspex to a low enough temp to make it brittle, but i'll look into it. I really would like to know what the custom tools they're using are, i've never really looked at making a Laser replica, but I just found a large sheet of mirror perspex in my shed from back in the day and it got me thinking. It's enough for two fronts or front and back, but not the sides which rules out the Mirror Manson. Anybody know how Musecasters did it? I'd ask him myself but i'm persona non grata in that respect for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musecasters Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Now that is a beautiful looking guitar, something i'd love to be able to replicate. I think it's unlikely that they'd be able to get the perspex to a low enough temp to make it brittle, but i'll look into it. I really would like to know what the custom tools they're using are, i've never really looked at making a Laser replica, but I just found a large sheet of mirror perspex in my shed from back in the day and it got me thinking. It's enough for two fronts or front and back, but not the sides which rules out the Mirror Manson. Anybody know how Musecasters did it? I'd ask him myself but i'm persona non grata in that respect for some reason. persona non grata? i never got yer email chap i broke it as Phill said but a massive balls ache and used a lot of material. try a flat surface, a ball bearing and rubber mallet. i've not tried it myself but in theory it should work :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Now that is a beautiful looking guitar, something i'd love to be able to replicate. I think it's unlikely that they'd be able to get the perspex to a low enough temp to make it brittle, but i'll look into it. I really would like to know what the custom tools they're using are, i've never really looked at making a Laser replica, but I just found a large sheet of mirror perspex in my shed from back in the day and it got me thinking. It's enough for two fronts or front and back, but not the sides which rules out the Mirror Manson. Anybody know how Musecasters did it? I'd ask him myself but i'm persona non grata in that respect for some reason. Yeah, unfortunately it doesn't look like that anymore what sort of temperature would that be? I think it was Jim (the one who had that HEAVILY modded ibanez with the rust finish) who said he heard it was done like that. I really have no idea about the tools, but I suppose the best bet would be to try what musecasters said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 Yeah, unfortunately it doesn't look like that anymore what sort of temperature would that be? I think it was Jim (the one who had that HEAVILY modded ibanez with the rust finish) who said he heard it was done like that. I really have no idea about the tools, but I suppose the best bet would be to try what musecasters said What happened to it??? I've tried cracking some test pieces using a rubber mallet and some stuff underneath, and I also tried the vice. Basically, I can get it to crack, but it comes away and has to be put back together. I guess I could have a bash at that method, but I was hoping there would be a better, more elegant solution. I've found it tends to bend till it finds a weak spot and then cracks right along the weakest point firing acrylic off in unpredictable directions. Musecasters, I hit you up on Facebook and on your Musecasters at gmail account but I never heard back so I assumed you didn't want to get back to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 What happened to it??? I've tried cracking some test pieces using a rubber mallet and some stuff underneath, and I also tried the vice. Basically, I can get it to crack, but it comes away and has to be put back together. I guess I could have a bash at that method, but I was hoping there would be a better, more elegant solution. I've found it tends to bend till it finds a weak spot and then cracks right along the weakest point firing acrylic off in unpredictable directions. Musecasters, I hit you up on Facebook and on your Musecasters at gmail account but I never heard back so I assumed you didn't want to get back to me. He's just busy I'm sure! that top got damaged when Mansons were cleaning it a few years back (apparently they were using some sort of machine to polish it). It has a relatively nice looking top now, but nothing like the one in the picture. What about wrapping the perspex in something and then cracking it? I'm sure someone mentioned they did that (maybe it was Phill...can't remember) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly. Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Mansons went through a lot of perspex for mine trying to recreate the m1d1 mirror as they changed their method I think, compromised with this though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 To be honest, I prefer that look to the M1D1, its a bit more interesting. I do like the tight linear cracks they achieved on the M1D1 though, but that bare Mahogany back... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomrulez Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 The M1D1 cracks are my favourite, can't someone just ask Tim or Hugh how it was done? I'm sure Jamie speaks to them fairly frequently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly. Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 They were done with a vice, but apparently very dangerous as it can split and fly off all over the place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 Well I just nipped out to my workshop (shed) and tried out a couple of techniques and I know how it's done now. They key is to apply steady pressure as you bend the mirror over on itself. A vice with large jaws would be ideal. I'm fairly confident I could replicate the M1D1 cracks quite easily. I quickly cut up a test piece suitable for a top and got the first few bends spot on to the Laser, but the bits below the bridge are not really the same. Does look good though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L32 Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 First time i used the mirror perspex i cleaned it with alcohol and it started to crack itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 yeah i was doing something similar by hand. wedging one side against the wall and bending the whole thing over in a steady curve. Sometime it would produce some really nice shattered breaks but now and again would snap clean in half and waste a sheet of perspex. I did have loads of photos of different attempts but looks like I may have deleted most of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomrulez Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 That one looks pretty good Phill, is that the one you ended up using? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 So, the question now is, do I order some more acrylic mirror an continue the experiments? anyone know where to source it for less than £10 a go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Yeah, it looked a bit sparse once it was all on there though. I think you need to put more cracks on closer together than you realise because once it's all cut out, stuck on and routed out there doesn't end up being a lot left on display if they are spaced out. That was the sheet it's shelf, I thought I was getting a bit carried away and there was too much going on until it was stuck on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly. Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 ah, love the look of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 Hmm, yeah that is a bit sparse I think. I much prefer the slightly chaotic look of the original. I wonder, would there be a problem if I was to mount the mirror I have to a body and make it available for sale to fund further experiments?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomrulez Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 Hmm, yeah that is a bit sparse I think. I much prefer the slightly chaotic look of the original. I wonder, would there be a problem if I was to mount the mirror I have to a body and make it available for sale to fund further experiments?? Nope not that I can see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 Ok, that sounds like a plan then. Any recommendations as to how much routing to do? Neck and pickups I guess, but what about control cavities? Also, twin Humbuckers or P90's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 I reckon twin humbucker is most versatile. HB sized P90s or HB are options. Neck pocket for tele style heel, control cavity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomrulez Posted January 16, 2013 Share Posted January 16, 2013 I reckon twin humbucker is most versatile. HB sized P90s or HB are options. Neck pocket for tele style heel, control cavity. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaicen Posted January 16, 2013 Author Share Posted January 16, 2013 Ok, that's decided then, or is it. What control cavity would be needed? Tone vol and 3 way switch? Is it worth adding in the cavity for the FF? I could always throw in one of my handmade Fuzz Factor E circuit boards I'm thinking I will leave the bridge un-drilled to accomodate any neck variation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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