Album Eight: Simulation Theory

[Nicklord]

AM played for 85 minutes when I saw them at the festival with 20 songs. It's easier when all the songs are 3m except for R U Mine which they play for like 6 minutes live

[CitizenAroused]

Why the fuck is Melon so late with the review? He reviewed Origins before ST wtf...

 

And why does the background pic is still Something Human?

 

Asking the real questions.

[New Born Lee]

I'm guessing YUNO review.

[Nigel_Tufnel]

are we still joking

 

Not if we're speaking purely about how to put together a set list.

[Nigel_Tufnel]

AM played for 85 minutes when I saw them at the festival with 20 songs. It's easier when all the songs are 3m except for R U Mine which they play for like 6 minutes live

 

The show I saw ran probably 100 minutes but that's without prerecorded playback nonsense and extended lulls between songs to accommodate special effects. And they played at least 2 or 3 songs from each of their albums. That's all I'm saying. Nothing too revolutionary.

 

I don't think Muse plays much longer than 85 minutes if you take away all the fluff.

[Jobby]

Not if we're speaking purely about how to put together a set list.

 

The show I saw ran probably 100 minutes but that's without prerecorded playback nonsense and extended lulls between songs to accommodate special effects. And they played at least 2 or 3 songs from each of their albums. That's all I'm saying. Nothing too revolutionary.

 

I don't think Muse plays much longer than 85 minutes if you take away all the fluff.

 

Things you’ve gotta consider are though, that AM have 2 less albums and considerably less b-sides/overall non-album music than Muse to fit in and their earlier albums have some of their absolute biggest hits (and even some of those were barebones shortened versions). Muse don’t have an IBYLGOTD or Mardy Bum on Showbiz, that’s why they don’t play owt from it. They played some non-hit early stuff like Ritz and Do Me A Favour, sure, but it’s not unlike Muse doing Sunburn or AP when they came back to London in 2016.

 

And the playback stuff has only really been a problem on one tour so far. If it continues then fair play but, as it stands, it’s not a fair assessment of their overall live reputation imo. If you take them at the same point Muse were in their career (T2L), there’s no comparison to me.

[005]

It's not a surprise to me that maybe finally Muse are losing fans..........this woeful new LP which is just as terrible as the last 3 & that Matt's pro brexit not to mention they couldn't even sell out the current 2 dates in London next year proves something......................oh & the predictable setlists since 2007

[New Born Lee]

Thanks for stopping by on the way to steal Christmas.

[FabriPav]

Things you’ve gotta consider are though, that AM have 2 less albums and considerably less b-sides/overall non-album music than Muse to fit in

 

What b-sides/non-album stuff do Muse play nowadays?

[Nigel_Tufnel]

And the playback stuff has only really been a problem on one tour so far. If it continues then fair play but, as it stands, it’s not a fair assessment of their overall live reputation imo. If you take them at the same point Muse were in their career (T2L), there’s no comparison to me.

 

If Muse doesn't want to live in the past with their set lists, fair enough, but then they need to be judged on the present not reputation. Or as it stands now their last tour. The Drones show that I saw had the usual Drill Sargeant, JFK, Isolated System and Dronezzz twice (not to mention 10 minutes of TG) but they couldn't be bothered to play a single song off their first two albums. For me, that's inexcusable. I'm not saying that they should be playing half of OoS or anything like that but could not have taken 4 minutes to even throw in Plug In Baby for the longtime fans? If they really think that fans are blown away by a fleet of half-functional floating orbs and some big video screens, then I don't know what to say.

 

I'm a bigger fan of Muse than AM but large portions of that Drones show were a bore. Can't say the same for the AM. Hopefully they can redeem themselves with the ST tour.

[Saint Rockwell]

Things you’ve gotta consider are though, that AM have 2 less albums and considerably less b-sides/overall non-album music than Muse to fit in and their earlier albums have some of their absolute biggest hits (and even some of those were barebones shortened versions). Muse don’t have an IBYLGOTD or Mardy Bum on Showbiz, that’s why they don’t play owt from it. They played some non-hit early stuff like Ritz and Do Me A Favour, sure, but it’s not unlike Muse doing Sunburn or AP when they came back to London in 2016.

 

And the playback stuff has only really been a problem on one tour so far. If it continues then fair play but, as it stands, it’s not a fair assessment of their overall live reputation imo. If you take them at the same point Muse were in their career (T2L), there’s no comparison to me.

 

Yeah they do, they just don't play Muscle Museum or Showbiz b/c they THINK people don't want to hear them when they very much DO...

 

Also AM have a large number of B-Sides too (that they also don't play live for whatever reason) so that point is kinda moot, although both bands have severely dropped off in terms of producing extra content (and before someone chimes in with bro haven't you seen the deluxe edition of ST, consider this: Glorious *mic drop*)

Edited November 19, 2018 by Saint Rockwell

[Saint Rockwell]

It's not a surprise to me that maybe finally Muse are losing fans..........this woeful new LP which is just as terrible as the last 3 & that Matt's pro brexit not to mention they couldn't even sell out the current 2 dates in London next year proves something......................oh & the predictable setlists since 2007

 

This album would be good if you were friends with Matt and one day he was like let me show you some demo's I've been working on, that way you could convince him to throw away half the album and rework the other half before things got serious

[Spectrum IV]

Two weeks later, still love this album.

 

Even DD, TC and SH are growing on me again. They work better in the context of the album, though acoustic SH is still better.

 

Blockades, Propaganda and BITM are the best three tracks they've done since BH&R.

 

Overall 8/10. I'd probably rate it a bit higher than Showbiz, but still feel there are a few less-than-great tracks holding it back from being one of their best.

Edited November 19, 2018 by Espectro Cuatro

[Jobby]

If Muse doesn't want to live in the past with their set lists, fair enough, but then they need to be judged on the present not reputation. Or as it stands now their last tour. The Drones show that I saw had the usual Drill Sargeant, JFK, Isolated System and Dronezzz twice (not to mention 10 minutes of TG) but they couldn't be bothered to play a single song off their first two albums. For me, that's inexcusable. I'm not saying that they should be playing half of OoS or anything like that but could not have taken 4 minutes to even throw in Plug In Baby for the longtime fans? If they really think that fans are blown away by a fleet of half-functional floating orbs and some big video screens, then I don't know what to say.

 

I'm a bigger fan of Muse than AM but large portions of that Drones show were a bore. Can't say the same for the AM. Hopefully they can redeem themselves with the ST tour.

 

You can’t really judge it on the present when they’re at different parts of their career though.

 

I don’t think it’s a case of not being bothered, they’ve shown they’re more than up for playing PIB since it’s around at 95% of gigs, it’s just thinking no one really knows them (rightly or wrongly). Again, if you wanna compare them to AM, they’re 6 records deep and from their first 2 they play (tmk) a few full songs, most of which are some of their biggest hits, a couple of short teases/excerpts once or twice - big hits again, and a couple of legit fan favourites. Same time in Muse’s career they were doing Host, Falling Down, Sunburn, PIB, Bliss, Dead Star, Hyper Music, Micro Cuts, Yes Please, CE, Agitated and New Born - and that’s not at small gigs. As for the production, whether all of us like it or not it does obvs impress a lot of other people, hence the awards and reputation they’ve built up. I think it’s harder for some of us ‘cos we became fans before the really mental stage shows started so we miss that relative simplicity but, for other people, it’s clearly what makes a Muse show. Tbh I know I’d rather see that than a bald Alex Turner in a beige suit lying on the floor or a keyboard as a highlight

 

Total opposite for me on that last part but that’s just opinion. Love the first 3 AM records but haven’t bothered to see them live for the last 2 ‘cos they seem so dull, moreso now than ever.

 

Yeah they do, they just don't play Muscle Museum or Showbiz b/c they THINK people don't want to hear them when they very much DO...

 

Also AM have a large number of B-Sides too (that they also don't play live for whatever reason) so that point is kinda moot, although both bands have severely dropped off in terms of producing extra content (and before someone chimes in with bro haven't you seen the deluxe edition of ST, consider this: Glorious *mic drop*)

 

The closest things Muse have to hits on Showbiz are Sunburn, Unintended and MM - none of which come anywhere near how well known those two AM songs are in their discography.

 

And Arctic Monkeys have non-album material but it’s not even close to the level of Muse.

[kueller]

If you asked everyone at the average show how many wanted to hear Muscle Museum I'd be surprised if a sizable percentage even knew what you were talking about.

[Saint Rockwell]

The problem with this argument is that live shows are built around satisfying the largest portion of the audience as possible, the mainstream if you will, the crowd that's there because they liked what they heard on the radio. If you were to take BOTH Muse and AM and do shows based purely on what the hardcore fans wanted to see, I'm sure there would be an even mix of songs from every album regardless of how many albums each band has in their discography

 

Also you wanna talk snooze-fest, don't get me started on Unintended

Edited November 19, 2018 by Saint Rockwell

[kueller]

No shit, that's why Muse's by-request shows have full crowds singing along to Muscle Museum but that wasn't the original point.

[Saint Rockwell]

No shit, that's why Muse's by-request shows have full crowds singing along to Muscle Museum but that wasn't the original point.

 

Okay well if you're basing it on quality of material overall, Muse have been spotty at best for the last ten years, AM you could make the argument didn't start to produce boring music 'til this last go around, and even then the last album is still pretty interesting even in its low points

 

And for the record this is not me saying I don't think Muse is great, clearly they are, just that they've gotten comfortable and it shows in their work

Edited November 20, 2018 by Saint Rockwell

[kueller]

I'm not making the argument of quality. That's a messy road that never ends well. Muse have singles from Showbiz but they're not nearly as popular as the ones from Absolution onwards which seem to be where most of their fanbase is from. Their closest equivalent to AM's "Dancefloor" is probably Plug In Baby and hence that gets played a ton. New Born showed up kinda often too but they seem to have just tired of the song some.

[Nigel_Tufnel]

Again, if you wanna compare them to AM, they’re 6 records deep and from their first 2 they play (tmk) a few full songs, most of which are some of their biggest hits, a couple of short teases/excerpts once or twice - big hits again, and a couple of legit fan favourites. Same time in Muse’s career they were doing Host, Falling Down, Sunburn, PIB, Bliss, Dead Star, Hyper Music, Micro Cuts, Yes Please, CE, Agitated and New Born

 

Muse were playing all those songs on the T2L tour? They played Sunburn and New Born at the gig that I saw. That was it.

[Clunge]

Indeed they were. The T2L tour got quite varied towards the end, especially in comparison with the Resistance tour which was pretty rigid throughout.

 

I think there are two key things; 1. At a typical Muse show, half the crowd won’t walk out if the band take five minutes out of the hit machine to play Muscle Museum, for instance.

 

2. As a fan, you want to turn up at your favourite band’s gig thinking anything is possible and/or anything could happen, hence making room for just one rarity would be enough to sate so many hardcore/dedicated fans, a proportion of whom will undoubtedly make up a decent enough chunk of the crowd (10%, perhaps).

[Niall]

We can probably expect more Showbiz, or at least some classic favourites towards the end of the next tour too of course - hopefully they'll be promoting their origin of muse compilation by then.

[dreamyana]

Indeed they were. The T2L tour got quite varied towards the end, especially in comparison with the Resistance tour which was pretty rigid throughout.

 

I think there are two key things; 1. At a typical Muse show, half the crowd won’t walk out if the band take five minutes out of the hit machine to play Muscle Museum, for instance.

 

2. As a fan, you want to turn up at your favourite band’s gig thinking anything is possible and/or anything could happen, hence making room for just one rarity would be enough to sate so many hardcore/dedicated fans, a proportion of whom will undoubtedly make up a decent enough chunk of the crowd (10%, perhaps).

 

^agree to that.

Not expecting them to compose half of the setlist from old songs. But one or two rarities (best a few in rotation, so it's different rarity every night) per gig would be enough to make me unbelievably happy

 

We can probably expect more Showbiz, or at least some classic favourites towards the end of the next tour too of course - hopefully they'll be promoting their origin of muse compilation by then.

 

That's what I'm hoping for...

[Nigel_Tufnel]

Indeed they were. The T2L tour got quite varied towards the end, especially in comparison with the Resistance tour which was pretty rigid throughout.

 

I think there are two key things; 1. At a typical Muse show, half the crowd won’t walk out if the band take five minutes out of the hit machine to play Muscle Museum, for instance.

 

2. As a fan, you want to turn up at your favourite band’s gig thinking anything is possible and/or anything could happen, hence making room for just one rarity would be enough to sate so many hardcore/dedicated fans, a proportion of whom will undoubtedly make up a decent enough chunk of the crowd (10%, perhaps).

 

Agreed. That's basically what I was saying yesterday about my Drones concert experience that included about 10 minutes of prerecorded playback but not a single song from the first two albums. Really pretty lame.

[Clunge]

Yup, can’t disagree on that. Chuck in New Kind Of Kick, a jam, four/five outro riffs, Unsustainable and Isolated System and you’ve got another 10-15 mins.