Macaroon Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 He's a mod - he let himself in. There's a key under the door mat anyway, saves people from having to guess what a p90 is before being let in. And I don't know. If it were me, I wouldn't be too bothered. Probably because my sound really isn't anything I've spent several years working on, since I change my pedalboard around way too frequently That's interesting. When I saw them, it was just like in the recordings, just a lot better obviously. I remember when they were checking Josh's setup at the beginning and it sounded fucking massive. No we shouldn't do that! He'd just tell us the truth.... and I don't want to hear that, as we'll find out it is in fact a gorilla solid state amp. Yeah I mean it still sounded huge, easily one of the best gigs I've seen to. If I'm honest the Leeds bands seemed to have a few problems with sound that year so may have been unintentional that it sounded that way, I was quite surprised. But yeah I don't know if I'd care giving away a sound. I actually have to find one first to be honest. Right, I wouldn't want you to find that out so I'll hold back. I can only imagine the grief that would follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 There's a key under the door mat anyway, saves people from having to guess what a p90 is before being let in. Yeah I mean it still sounded huge, easily one of the best gigs I've seen to. If I'm honest the Leeds bands seemed to have a few problems with sound that year so may have been unintentional that it sounded that way, I was quite surprised. But yeah I don't know if I'd care giving away a sound. I actually have to find one first to be honest. Right, I wouldn't want you to find that out so I'll hold back. I can only imagine the grief that would follow. But if we don't know what a P90 is, how are we all here now? And that's fair enough. The one QOTSA gig I've been to is definitely in my top three: 1. Muse at Webster Hall (for so many reasons - meeting them, getting to see some rare songs, and just the fact that it was such a small gig) 2. QOTSA at Capitol Theater (just an incredible gig all around, couldn't ask for anything else - although I sort of wish I hung around a few more hours to meet them) 3. Royal Blood at Webster Hall (great set list, getting to lift Ben into the crowd at the end, as well as getting to meet him afterwards - really nice guy) Sorry, just in a list making mood. That is definitely true. I haven't owned my tone yet. /TGP And don't worry, I can handle it. Remember that time that guy convinced us that citizen erased was recorded on a 7 string? Although, I guess that's a bit different since he was wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D3adstar Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Yeah definitely. Any idea what years they're from? I think they made the original UK versions up until around 2009. So really any DSL from 2004 until 2009 or so would be a good one. My orange crunch DSL 100 is a 1998, and it sounds brilliant, but the only reason I'd advise against getting an older one is because of the main board issue The ones I've found for reasonable money have all been from around 2002-2006, I'll keep looking out for a 2004-2009 one, the prospect of possible main board issues, sounds expensive I think they actually looked the price up of a 1980's les paul a while back and compared them, and it would actually be in the price range of a mid range LP. They sold for $400 I believe, and I'm guessing a LP standard or custom would be a fair bit more. They are called "LP killers" by some, but I think they're different enough. It's just one of those weird guitars really - everything came together incredibly well, but they didn't sell because of what was popular at the time, and just being a bit unusual in general. http://poppoppopno.blogspot.com/2015/06/why-i-hated-eastwood-gp.html There's a rumor that Ovation (now that they're making guitars again) might be reissuing the GP, but it still seems unlikely at this point. They did tweet about it - basically just asking if they should bring it back, but that could mean anything. The double-cut shape of the GP and the contours on the back, put them above Les Paul's for me I've just found that tweet, would be great if they did a reissue of the GP, but I can imagine they'd price them extremely high, due to the exploding prices of the originals It's scary close at this point. I'll get a sound clip up once the VT40 comes back. It's definitely the closest I've heard! Would be great to hear it through the VT40! No we shouldn't do that! He'd just tell us the truth.... and I don't want to hear that, as we'll find out it is in fact a gorilla solid state amp. This is a scary prospect One day when its viable I'd love to sink some cash into nailing some of Jack White's tones. What can I say boys I just fucking love fuzz. Check out this - http://www.andertons.co.uk/compact-pedals/pid36491/cid692/jhs-pedals-twin-twelve-drive-pedal.asp?LGWCODE=36491;56375;6335&gclid=Cj0KEQiAqK-zBRC2zaXc8MOiwfIBEiQAXPHrXrLIZIog7fnhWX4KEuRaM1-mGmsAX75gffLfdXKOSZEaArRV8P8HAQ It's meant to give you the tone of those vintage Silvertone head's that White uses! One of those, a whammy and a big muff would definitely put you in the right direction! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 (edited) But if we don't know what a P90 is, how are we all here now? Well, because of the key. And that's fair enough. The one QOTSA gig I've been to is definitely in my top three: 1. Muse at Webster Hall (for so many reasons - meeting them, getting to see some rare songs, and just the fact that it was such a small gig) 2. QOTSA at Capitol Theater (just an incredible gig all around, couldn't ask for anything else - although I sort of wish I hung around a few more hours to meet them) 3. Royal Blood at Webster Hall (great set list, getting to lift Ben into the crowd at the end, as well as getting to meet him afterwards - really nice guy) Sorry, just in a list making mood. That is definitely true. I haven't owned my tone yet. /TGP And don't worry, I can handle it. Remember that time that guy convinced us that citizen erased was recorded on a 7 string? Although, I guess that's a bit different since he was wrong Yeah well, unless I see someone post a picture of themselves next to Matt in the studio with their username written on a sign round their neck, I'm pretty much okay with taking little insights like that with a bag of salt. Oh shit okay are we listing? Right. Ranking is hard for me, I know what gigs are up there but thinking about which was better is always a tough task. I think I'll go for: 1) Muse - Rock Werchter. Yes, yes I saw them on the Psycho tour. And to be honest that gig could easily be here instead. I've picked Werchter because this set signed off probably one of the best weeks of my life, the sentimental value of this gig is pretty heavy. The setlist was also pretty damn good (got CE which I did not on the Psycho tour!) and the Mercy performance took me completely by surprise. 2) QoTSA - Leeds. Basically just reiterating what you said. Flawless performance when I was still a bit unsure how I felt about them. Absolutely cemented them as one of my favourite bands and Josh Homme as the coolest cat on fucking earth. 3) Tough one.. Royal Blood/Drenge (Werchter/Leeds). Drenge was another first time seeing a band, and they killed it. Two mosh pits came together and merged into one the size of a tennis court. Whole gig had such energy. Royal Blood twice in two days was pretty special as well though. And again the fact it was at Werchter probably just pushes them above Drenge. Honourable mention as well for Turbowolf in Glasgow this October. Those guys are fecking mad. Check out this - http://www.andertons.co.uk/compact-pedals/pid36491/cid692/jhs-pedals-twin-twelve-drive-pedal.asp?LGWCODE=36491;56375;6335&gclid=Cj0KEQiAqK-zBRC2zaXc8MOiwfIBEiQAXPHrXrLIZIog7fnhWX4KEuRaM1-mGmsAX75gffLfdXKOSZEaArRV8P8HAQ It's meant to give you the tone of those vintage Silvertone head's that White uses! One of those, a whammy and a big muff would definitely put you in the right direction! Yes! I've looked at those before actually. I was close to buying one before realising that with a bit of snooping there are some ~64 Silvertones (I think its the 1484 head Jack uses?) available for about £280.. This was a while back, however, so I may be getting mixed up. If so, it seems a bit daft sinking £150 for a pedal that emulates a vintage amp that you can get for only 100 more! Big yes on the Big Muff though. It's only a matter of time before I have one of those. And please don't get me started on Whammys edit: actually, having now gone back to search up the 1484 again. I've been reminded that the originals only had Volume, treble and bass controls on each channel. So to actually get a nice overdriven sound you have to crank the thing up to its 60 watt mega-volume. Which probably isn't what I want The price you pay for toan..... Edited December 12, 2015 by Macaroon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D3adstar Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 (edited) Oh shit okay are we listing? Right. Ranking is hard for me, I know what gigs are up there but thinking about which was better is always a tough task. It's way harder than I thought it would be to rank concerts 1) Muse - Rock Werchter 2015 I completely lost my shit when Citizen Erased appeared out of nowhere, Stockholm Syndrome was incredible with the Township riff at the end. Plus Mercy was so great live with the whole stage show (didn't care for the album version at all beforehand). Plus the festival itself was such a great week! 2) Soundgarden - BST Festival 2014 Played the whole of the Superunknown album from start to finish, one of my all time favourite albums! 3) Muse - Emirates Stadium 2013 First Muse concert, got Deadstar which at the time was my all time favourite song (hence username ), really great show! 4) Black Sabbath - BST Festival 2014 What else is there to say, its fucking Black Sabbath. 5) Alice in Chains - Alexandra Palace 2014 Amazing concert, the song Rooster blew my mind. 6) Prodigy - Rock Werchter 2015 Most insane mosh pits I've ever been in, crazy stage presence and a great night! Yes! I've looked at those before actually. I was close to buying one before realising that with a bit of snooping there are some ~64 Silvertones (I think its the 1484 head Jack uses?) available for about £280.. This was a while back, however, so I may be getting mixed up. If so, it seems a bit daft sinking £150 for a pedal that emulates a vintage amp that you can get for only 100 more! Big yes on the Big Muff though. It's only a matter of time before I have one of those. And please don't get me started on Whammys edit: actually, having now gone back to search up the 1484 again. I've been reminded that the originals only had Volume, treble and bass controls on each channel. So to actually get a nice overdriven sound you have to crank the thing up to its 60 watt mega-volume. Which probably isn't what I want The price you pay for toan..... The pedal does seem pretty great, but I agree £150 is pretty steep, there's a Catalinbread SFT pedal that emulates the old Ampegs but again for a few hundred more you can get the real deal! I also did a bit of snooping on the prices of the Silvertone heads, would be great to find one cheap, but they seem pretty hard to find in the UK... Edit: Buy it... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-1966-Sears-Silvertone-1484-Guitar-Head-Worldwide-Ship-/262179064215?hash=item3d0b170997:g:gGEAAOSw7FRWZNWp Edited December 13, 2015 by D3adstar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Is this one legit? https://reverb.com/item/1414104-silvertone-1484-head-1964-black Still in the States, though... I second everything you said about Werchter! I've made no secret on this board how much I loved Mercy, as like yourself I wasn't much of a fan before seeing it live. As is the case with many songs over my taste to be honest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D3adstar Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Is this one legit? https://reverb.com/item/1414104-silvertone-1484-head-1964-black Still in the States, though... Looks great! Although I don't really know what to look for in them... But that price really doesn't seem too crazy, although import fees/shipping could probably add up Edit: This could be useful, gives a good price guide on them https://reverb.com/price-guide/guide/8751-silvertone-1484-head-1963-grey I second everything you said about Werchter! I've made no secret on this board how much I loved Mercy, as like yourself I wasn't much of a fan before seeing it live. As is the case with many songs over my taste to be honest Definitely! Was such a great week! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Looks great! Although I don't really know what to look for in them... But that price really doesn't seem too crazy, although import fees/shipping could probably add up Edit: This could be useful, gives a good price guide on them https://reverb.com/price-guide/guide/8751-silvertone-1484-head-1963-grey Definitely! Was such a great week! That's a great reference, thanks. Will have to keep eyes and ears pealed for one in the UK... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Well, because of the key. Yeah well, unless I see someone post a picture of themselves next to Matt in the studio with their username written on a sign round their neck, I'm pretty much okay with taking little insights like that with a bag of salt. Oh shit okay are we listing? Right. Ranking is hard for me, I know what gigs are up there but thinking about which was better is always a tough task. I think I'll go for: 1) Muse - Rock Werchter. Yes, yes I saw them on the Psycho tour. And to be honest that gig could easily be here instead. I've picked Werchter because this set signed off probably one of the best weeks of my life, the sentimental value of this gig is pretty heavy. The setlist was also pretty damn good (got CE which I did not on the Psycho tour!) and the Mercy performance took me completely by surprise. 2) QoTSA - Leeds. Basically just reiterating what you said. Flawless performance when I was still a bit unsure how I felt about them. Absolutely cemented them as one of my favourite bands and Josh Homme as the coolest cat on fucking earth. 3) Tough one.. Royal Blood/Drenge (Werchter/Leeds). Drenge was another first time seeing a band, and they killed it. Two mosh pits came together and merged into one the size of a tennis court. Whole gig had such energy. Royal Blood twice in two days was pretty special as well though. And again the fact it was at Werchter probably just pushes them above Drenge. Honourable mention as well for Turbowolf in Glasgow this October. Those guys are fecking mad. Yes! I've looked at those before actually. I was close to buying one before realising that with a bit of snooping there are some ~64 Silvertones (I think its the 1484 head Jack uses?) available for about £280.. This was a while back, however, so I may be getting mixed up. If so, it seems a bit daft sinking £150 for a pedal that emulates a vintage amp that you can get for only 100 more! Big yes on the Big Muff though. It's only a matter of time before I have one of those. And please don't get me started on Whammys edit: actually, having now gone back to search up the 1484 again. I've been reminded that the originals only had Volume, treble and bass controls on each channel. So to actually get a nice overdriven sound you have to crank the thing up to its 60 watt mega-volume. Which probably isn't what I want The price you pay for toan..... Oh. Right. That's interesting about werchter. I haven't seen them at any festivals on this tour (or at all, for that matter..) but seeing them on the psycho tour was surreal, as rust relic put it. I definitely want to see turbowolf at some point. Also Marmozets. I recall Marmozets were playing some gigs with Turbowolf as support, but I never got tickets for that. Those might have been the ones that got cancelled though. As for the silvertone, inb4niel. Jack White uses the 1485, but honestly... I've had three different 1484 heads, and a 1485 matching head/cab setup, and they are NOWHERE near as loud as you'd expect. You can get them to distort at a relatively low volume (well, not low as in 'bedroom' volume, but not much higher than that) The best thing about those amps is the shockingly bad reverb with the built in poltergeist it's funny how bad it sounds It's way harder than I thought it would be to rank concerts 1) Muse - Rock Werchter 2015 I completely lost my shit when Citizen Erased appeared out of nowhere, Stockholm Syndrome was incredible with the Township riff at the end. Plus Mercy was so great live with the whole stage show (didn't care for the album version at all beforehand). Plus the festival itself was such a great week! 2) Soundgarden - BST Festival 2014 Played the whole of the Superunknown album from start to finish, one of my all time favourite albums! 3) Muse - Emirates Stadium 2013 First Muse concert, got Deadstar which at the time was my all time favourite song (hence username ), really great show! 4) Black Sabbath - BST Festival 2014 What else is there to say, its fucking Black Sabbath. 5) Alice in Chains - Alexandra Palace 2014 Amazing concert, the song Rooster blew my mind. 6) Prodigy - Rock Werchter 2015 Most insane mosh pits I've ever been in, crazy stage presence and a great night! Did you go to any of the psycho tour shows? I remember being upset that you didn't tell the rest of K&T that you were going to emirates. Would've loved to see your reaction to dead star I'm still not sure whether I preferred the first or second night. I think the second night was a better overall show, but the crowd around me was a bit dead (less drunk) compared to the first night, which killed the energy a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Yeah absolutely, I went to Werchter for a variety of reasons, not just Muse. And didn't expect their set to live up to Psycho tour at all, surreal is a very good description of how it felt seeing them 5 yards away playing b sides. I never expected to have it matched but somehow they did it. For different reasons too which is almost more impressive. I can definitely vouch for Marmozets live, seen them twice now and they really are great. Turbowolf was an odd gig just for the tiny size, but they just sounded huge from start to finish. Always funny seeing the drummer of the band pushing through the crowd with his kick drum before the set. Ah okay, it's the 1485. That's interesting about the volume. Perhaps it may just be their age? The punch just deteriorating a bit. They do strike me somewhat as a bit of a novelty. It's something that if I bought one it would be for a secondary set up just for Jacking Off™. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Yeah absolutely, I went to Werchter for a variety of reasons, not just Muse. And didn't expect their set to live up to Psycho tour at all, surreal is a very good description of how it felt seeing them 5 yards away playing b sides. I never expected to have it matched but somehow they did it. For different reasons too which is almost more impressive. I can definitely vouch for Marmozets live, seen them twice now and they really are great. Turbowolf was an odd gig just for the tiny size, but they just sounded huge from start to finish. Always funny seeing the drummer of the band pushing through the crowd with his kick drum before the set. Ah okay, it's the 1485. That's interesting about the volume. Perhaps it may just be their age? The punch just deteriorating a bit. They do strike me somewhat as a bit of a novelty. It's something that if I bought one it would be for a secondary set up just for Jacking Off™. I really need to see them at a festival then. I've done everything else. and yeah, definitely. I still can't even... this was basically my view. I think the guy filming was right in front of me. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJkpB_IQcMw Marmozets are definitely on my list of bands to see. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAy7oMnho-0 And nothing to do with the age really. They were just cheaply made, and some of the components weren't efficient. I imagine some had to do with the design as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witz Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Marmozets are great, I've seen them twice and managed to see most of their songs in them gigs. Looking forward to seeing what they do next Them and royal blood of course Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Yup, two MASSIVE second albums for those two! And James, it doesn't get much closer than that. This was my view for the whole thing. Standing that close got very very tiring! Yeah I heard that the amps were a total flop cos of their quality for a long time until people started finding those raspy distortion sounds from them, all of a sudden they are 'vintage' Also, speaking of next albums. What's happening with this next QoTSA release James? I've not been following closely at all but weren't they supposed to start work late 2014? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Yup, two MASSIVE second albums for those two! And James, it doesn't get much closer than that. This was my view for the whole thing. Standing that close got very very tiring! Yeah I heard that the amps were a total flop cos of their quality for a long time until people started finding those raspy distortion sounds from them, all of a sudden they are 'vintage' Also, speaking of next albums. What's happening with this next QoTSA release James? I've not been following closely at all but weren't they supposed to start work late 2014? Yesss Yeah, apparently the ones in front of me were queueing since 3pm the day before, so I can't really complain! And it wasn't so much that it was tiring, but the room was just too hot and I made the mistake of not drinking before. I've never been anywhere near that dehydrated in my life... and they charged $5 for one bottle of generic water And yeah pretty much. Sort of like how no one knew (that could've been a great pun...) about the ovation GPs until Josh Homme started using them, and now they're worth $2500+ ... woodwork from korea, parts from germany, and assembled in the U.S.... they're probably worth around $1000 (excluding the QOTSA points, which add about $1500 - sometimes more) I have no idea either. I feel like I should've been following them more closely... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james90 Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 For what it's worth: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Yesss Yeah, apparently the ones in front of me were queueing since 3pm the day before, so I can't really complain! And it wasn't so much that it was tiring, but the room was just too hot and I made the mistake of not drinking before. I've never been anywhere near that dehydrated in my life... and they charged $5 for one bottle of generic water And yeah pretty much. Sort of like how no one knew (that could've been a great pun...) about the ovation GPs until Josh Homme started using them, and now they're worth $2500+ ... woodwork from korea, parts from germany, and assembled in the U.S.... they're probably worth around $1000 (excluding the QOTSA points, which add about $1500 - sometimes more) I have no idea either. I feel like I should've been following them more closely... Yeah man the heat and dehydration were a killer. There was a lot of pushing at my gig too so being at the front was very wearing. If it was bad for me at 6'3 and 180lbs then who knows how some of the smaller fans coped! All worth it though. My favourite example is Jack White's Montgomery Airline. Those things are made of bloody plastic and now go for £000's hahaha. People confuse me. That's my feeling as well. Feel like I failed in a duty haha. It always feels a bit more laid back with QoTSA though. For me the nature of their music is such that there's never a rush to get more. It fills you up so nicely. When it comes it comes but in the meantime there's plenty to go around Compare that to Muse :shocked: .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D3adstar Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 I've had three different 1484 heads, and a 1485 matching head/cab setup Do I dare ask how many amps you have actually owned? Did you go to any of the psycho tour shows? I really wanted to go to the Psycho tour but missed out getting tickets on the release date and then couldn't afford the ridiculous price some of the online ticket sites were charging for them! I remember being upset that you didn't tell the rest of K&T that you were going to emirates. Would've loved to see your reaction to dead star Emirates all happened so fast, it was in the middle of my exam season at school, and I only managed to get the tickets two days before the actual concert, so it was all a bit rushed My reaction to Dead Star was pretty incredible I'm still not sure whether I preferred the first or second night. I think the second night was a better overall show, but the crowd around me was a bit dead (less drunk) compared to the first night, which killed the energy a bit. I was gutted about the 2nd night getting MOP and Stockholm, but otherwise the first night was an incredible concert! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Do I dare ask how many amps you have actually owned? In mathematical terms that's the same as asking what the square root of -1 is. It's complex, and no-one truly knows the answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottST Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 For me - 1 -Muse SECC Glasgow 2006 - Bliss & Assassin ftw. We got Exo Politics the night before in Aberdeen though... 2 - Radiohead glasgow green 2008. Jonny was on fire that night, so damn good 3 - rage against the machine finsbury park 2010. Just cos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D3adstar Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 In mathematical terms that's the same as asking what the square root of -1 is. It's complex, and no-one truly knows the answer. It's a scary concept Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macaroon Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 3 - rage against the machine finsbury park 2010. Just cos DAMN YOU! :'( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottST Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 DAMN YOU! :'( Saw them again a few days later at download 2010 too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D3adstar Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 3 - rage against the machine finsbury park 2010. Just cos Supreme jealously levels right now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerd herd Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 For what it's worth: Well, that's given me the fear Saw them again a few days later at download 2010 too So lucky! Don't think I've been to enough gigs to make a proper list, but Muse at Barrowlands and Death Cab at the O2 Academy this year would top it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Witz Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 I was gutted about the 2nd night getting MOP and Stockholm, but otherwise the first night was an incredible concert! We also got sunburn and butterflies and hurricanes My top three would be 1. Muse at Emirates, it was so over the top, my first time seeing muse and the setlist was the perfect balance between old and new, 2.Royal Blood's Brighton home coming Christmas celebration, it was intimate, Christmasey and everyone there knew the band 3. Muse at Brighton dome, the last date of the UK psycho tour, we got bliss, MOTP, the groove, Uno and the debut of dead inside. The crowd was insane and it was such a laugh I should add I think Rainbows only UK date that I have tickets too next year could top the list. The thought of Ritchie Blackmore playing rock again in rainbow form after all these years is enough to make me giddy already Also seeing ELO next year so that should be good too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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