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Anyone notice how bad Origin of Symmetry sounds?


sangforabsolution
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That is true, but OoS isn't completely dominated by the loudness war. In the pic I have Hyper Music (one of the "loudest" in OoS)with Broken Beat and Scarred from Death Magnetic. You can see Hyper Music still has some range. Both aren't the highest quality (I really should re-rip the files, but laziness).

 

 

loudnessoosdeathmagnetic.jpg

I personally don't think OoS is effected at all by the loudness war.

 

Just to stop you there, the "Loudness War" has always existed and somehow irrelevant to this thread, as all subsequent Muse albums are far worse in that respect.

 

Motown records were always intentionally tinny to help them sound louder on radio. Pioneering 60's producers like Phil Specktor and Joe Meek made a lot of use of limiters/levelling amplifiers to achieve their sounds.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NMnQdtFGOU

 

Another technique was to keep the songs as short as possible, which allows for the grooves in vinyl to be larger, allowing for greater volume, having less bass also allowed for the same. An iPod today is no different to a 60's jukebox.

 

Not all music suffers from modern techniques for increasing volume. Electronic music doesn't tend to suffer as much, if at all as there are plenty of techniques to help increase loudness, some of them actually introduce dynamics into the music (Sidechain compression and all that). Unfortunately these techniques don't translate well into rock music. -

 

Subsequent Muse albums should have mastered quieter (Absolution & BH&R sound crap on a decent set of speakers), but OOS gains as the approach of a "live band with everything set to 11, too loud for the studio and smoke pouring out of the mixing desk & limiters" comes across wonderfully. Might not be perfect production, but who cares?

 

Also, sometimes people want their music over-compressed, as long as it's what the artists themselves want, then judge it with an open mind.

 

I agree (although, for me The Resistance sounds decent).

I wonder how many people complain about sound quality, yet listen to low quality mp3's on an ipod with the free ear buds?

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I personally don't think OoS is effected at all by the loudness war.

 

 

 

I agree (although, for me The Resistance sounds decent).

I wonder how many people complain about sound quality, yet listen to low quality mp3's on an ipod with the free ear buds?

If you agree, why the hell did you bring it up in the first place?

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I've never noticed until now how bad OoS sounds. It's way too loud and distorted.

 

loud? why the hell are you complaining about the volume?

 

 

If you agree, why the hell did you bring it up in the first place?

 

I didn't bring it up 1st, it's part of the 1st statement.

 

Also the question was asked "why the hell are you complaining about the volume?".

 

I thought it was worth clarifying that there is a difference between ' volume ' and 'loudness' as in 'the loudness war'. I figured there are those who are blissfully unaware of this loudness problem. "Modern albums that use such extreme dynamic range compression therefore sacrifice sound quality to loudness ".

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I thought it was worth clarifying that there is a difference between ' volume ' and 'loudness' as in 'the loudness war'. I figured there are those who are blissfully unaware of this loudness problem. "Modern albums that use such extreme dynamic range compression therefore sacrifice sound quality to loudness ".

 

"Loudness" is not a technical term and it's not always a problem.

 

It's possible to make loud music without compressing the fuck out of it. Loveless by My Bloody Valentine is a fabulous example (Although the CD peaks at -4dBFS, which is bloody annoying). A remastering of that album with just the slightest touch of limiting would probably be louder than anything being released today.

 

Also how you perceive how loud something is not purely about how compressed it is. Remember one time setting up in a studio and was playing some songs through the Genelecs the place had, two of the songs we put on was Plug In Baby & Stockholm Syndrome. Plug In Baby came screaming out and seemed louder than SS, despite technically being quieter.

 

 

Always trust your ears more than your eyes, people who post images of audio files and complain about the lack of dynamics might be missing the point, maybe it's meant to be like that? Not all music will sound great if it was left to breathe. Garage Blues for example would make no sense to anyone if it was clean and didn't sound like arse.

Edited by haze015
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"Loudness" is not a technical term and it's not always a problem.

only a problem sometimes, when the music can sound better.

Better is not a technical term but you probably get the jest.

 

Always trust your ears more than your eyes

I always do.

 

Garage Blues for example would make no sense to anyone if it was clean and didn't sound like arse.

I've never heard of Garage Blues but I get your point.

 

Anyway back on topic - OoS could sound better, nothing to do with 'the loudness war' but it is what it is and who would change it. No doubt the record company will re-release the back catalogue soon re-mastered. Just to make a few extra notes. They always do.

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Anyway back on topic - OoS could sound better, nothing to do with 'the loudness war' but it is what it is and who would change it. No doubt the record company will re-release the back catalogue soon re-mastered. Just to make a few extra notes. They always do.

 

If Absolution can sound better I'll be OK with it

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bass is borderline inaudible unless you really concentrate, for one, and has absolutely no meat-to-the-bone. drums - esp the snare - is missing a certain kick. lots of other things.

 

it's just a bit of a mess, really.

 

it's a shame because that's one song that i reckon, if mastered properly, could sound absolutely amazing on record. but as is...

Edited by spark_
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bass is borderline inaudible unless you really concentrate, for one, and has absolutely no meat-to-the-bone. drums - esp the snare - is missing a certain kick. lots of other things.

 

it's just a bit of a mess, really.

 

it's a shame because that's one song that i reckon, if mastered properly, could sound absolutely amazing on record. but as is...

 

I have always loved the bass in the live version but never noticed it's absence on the record. But I still prefer the studio version although I love some of the live changes such as "since I lost you" and the awesome third "right".

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Is it likely that Absolution will be remastered for its 10th anniversary? I don't find much to fault with the production myself compared to other albums. Ones like Metallica's "And Justice For All" (very reedy sound) and Slipknot's "The Subliminal Verses" (though it's my favourite album by them, I think the guitars and drums have less impact than in their other work) have considerably bigger faults in the production than any of Muse's catalogue in my opinion.

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Is it likely that Absolution will be remastered for its 10th anniversary? I don't find much to fault with the production myself compared to other albums. Ones like Metallica's "And Justice For All" (very reedy sound) and Slipknot's "The Subliminal Verses" (though it's my favourite album by them, I think the guitars and drums have less impact than in their other work) have considerably bigger faults in the production than any of Muse's catalogue in my opinion.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if it was, the mainstream media seem to think of Absolution as Muse's best album. The only album I have a problem with the production on was the production on The Resistance, which which was well produced, don't get me wrong, but it wasn't to my taste. I remember one person describing Abso as 'unlistenable' due to the production, so obviously some would like to see it remastered.

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I remember one person describing Abso as 'unlistenable' due to the production, so obviously some would like to see it remastered.

It's maybe not that extreme but I see where they're coming from. Absolution's my second favourite album by them but I still listen to it the least out of the five, and tend to only stick to live recordings.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Does anyone know who remastered "Bleach" by Nirvana? I thought that was a pretty good job.

 

"This 20th Anniversary Edition has been re-mastered from the original tapes at Sterling Sound in a session overseen by producer Jack Endino."

 

Taken from Amazon.com

 

Endino was the producer of the original Bleach as well.

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Yeah, did you notice how poorly Matt's vocals were recorded in Micro Cuts? They sound so distorted!

 

:LOL:

 

This made the ten minutes remaining in my day.

 

I think it would benefit from having the guitars made a bit more raw. I reckon they should get Trent Reznor to do it, his remastering of "Pretty Hate Machine" really improved the sound of that album.

 

Agreed!

 

Is it likely that Absolution will be remastered for its 10th anniversary? I don't find much to fault with the production myself compared to other albums. Ones like Metallica's "And Justice For All" (very reedy sound) and Slipknot's "The Subliminal Verses" (though it's my favourite album by them, I think the guitars and drums have less impact than in their other work) have considerably bigger faults in the production than any of Muse's catalogue in my opinion.

 

Agreed again, on it being a good idea.

Edited by RayFan9876
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Indeed. Though it certainly doesn't match this millennium's "clean, crisp" production, maybe that's what he meant.

 

There hasn't been any particular trend in production since 2000 unless you only listen to a handful of genres. The only real trend has been digital becoming more common, which if anything, has resulted in the use of distortion becoming more common.

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I think the production's pretty good, though I think Absolution could do with a job that brings out a bit more oomph in the guitar, rawer than the original mix. I reckon Origin has a better sound overall, while their subsequent stuff is just a little to slick.

 

In terms of sound, I'm quite glad Muse didn't go with Rick Rubin as a producer for The Resistance, seeing as I've found the sound of quite a lot of things he's produced lately a bit "flat" or "colourless". A Thousand Suns by Linkin Park being a good example- I thought the album was pretty good, but I felt that on tracks like "Blackout" and "Wretches and Kings" the guitars and distorted synths lacked impact. Same problem with "The Subliminal Verses" - I don't think it's possible to completely take the edge off Jim Root and Mick Thompson's guitar playing, but certainly the guitars don't create the monstrous walls of noise that you get on their previous and subsequent work.

 

Maybe they should get Robinson to produce the new album? Contentious I know, but what are anyone's views on that?

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