Jetro Posted January 26, 2011 Posted January 26, 2011 I deeply apologise in advance if this thread has been made before. I have a question regarding Black Holes and Revelations. It is claimed that it was influenced by various styles of music: MUSICAL STYLE Muse's album Black Holes and Revelations was influenced by various styles of European and Asian music. "I've been listening to quite a lot of music from the south of Italy on this album", Bellamy admits. "I've been living in Italy for a while, and I discovered this music from Naples, which sounds like a mix of music from Africa, Croatia, Turkey, and Italy. It kind of gives it a mystical sound, so I think that's one thing that influenced the album. I like being influenced by things that have a mixed style". To me, the whole album except for three tracks sound Anglo-American – like the songs they have done before. The three exceptions are: - City of Delusion - Hoodoo - Knights of Cydonia which also happen to be the last tracks on the album. The definitely sound foreign/exotic, but all in the same category: Latin-American. City of Delusion and Hoodoo sounds like something that could have been in the Zorro films. Knights of Cydonia sounds like something more of a western – southern USA, or Mexico. Whereas the rest of the album sound 'standard' as far as musical style goes, namely Anglo-American. In their next album, The Resistance, they are entirely back to Anglo-American music, except of course from United States of Eurasia. So, is it something I am missing here? Are there tracks on Black Holes and Revelations I have not listed that have African, Croatian, Turkish or Italian influences? I don't hear it. I'm not a musical expert at any stage, but I only get that 'foreign' vibe from these three mentioned songs. Thank you!
haze015 Posted January 26, 2011 Posted January 26, 2011 Knights of Cydonia is very Joe Meek/Surf-rock in it's influences. The former from Gloucestershire, the latter, California. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yL-z-uwdk08 "Anglo-American" is an extremely bad term to use, as what do you mean by "Anglo"? "American" would be Blues/Jazz. Anything you could call truly British would be folk music and there's none of that in Muse at all, that only ever really entered in popular music through 70's British Prog bands. Otherwise it's a mixture of American & European influences.
macgivera Posted January 26, 2011 Posted January 26, 2011 I deeply apologise in advance if this thread has been made before. I have a question regarding Black Holes and Revelations. It is claimed that it was influenced by various styles of music. To me, the whole album except for three tracks sound Anglo-American – like the songs they have done before. The three exceptions are: - City of Delusion - Hoodoo - Knights of Cydonia which also happen to be the last tracks on the album. The definitely sound foreign/exotic, but all in the same category: Latin-American. City of Delusion and Hoodoo sounds like something that could have been in the Zorro films. Knights of Cydonia sounds like something more of a western – southern USA, or Mexico. Whereas the rest of the album sound 'standard' as far as musical style goes, namely Anglo-American. In their next album, The Resistance, they are entirely back to Anglo-American music, except of course from United States of Eurasia. So, is it something I am missing here? Are there tracks on Black Holes and Revelations I have not listed that have African, Croatian, Turkish or Italian influences? I don't hear it. I'm not a musical expert at any stage, but I only get that 'foreign' vibe from these three mentioned songs. Thank you! You definitely must become accustomed, that Muse has it's label, and they need to promote their new albums, and usually they talk a lot about few elements. TR - 'symphonic monster', 'three piece song', '15 minute solo' etc, and they knew, that they did eccelent job with Knights of Cydonia and were talking in majority about it and similar songs. Not every interview is 100 % accurate. Exogenesis isn't 15 minute long, but it's length is similar. Last three BHaR tracks aren't African/Croatian/Turkish, but they have different style than other songs. I think talking about exotic influences is more interesting and better way to promote album, than 'yes, we did new shitty pop song called Starlight, we wanted to break into the charts, it's not very complicated and influenced.'. I hope I helped a bit.
JrMan Posted January 26, 2011 Posted January 26, 2011 City of Delusion sounds like this Portuguese band's song that came out in 1997
Jetro Posted January 26, 2011 Author Posted January 26, 2011 "Anglo-American" is an extremely bad term to use, as what do you mean by "Anglo"? I know it's probably a bad term; what I mean by it is 'Western' music (not the genre), the kind of melodies, or note scales, that are the norm in Europe and America. The reason I used 'Anglo' as a term was because I believe that Great Britain was the birthplace of modern music (almost all music we listen to is in English), even if the US has surpassed it. But hell, I'm not a historian... If you go to Turkey, for instance, and you will mostly hear local, Arabic-themed music. I know it's generalising, but I'm trying to put a finger on what I mean. Many places are entirely cut off from the kind of music we westerners listen to, and it's completely different. Last three BHaR tracks aren't African/Croatian/Turkish, but they have different style than other songs. Right, but isn't it a bit fun that all of them sound like Zorro/Western themes? Or is that just me? I think talking about exotic influences is more interesting and better way to promote album, than 'yes, we did new shitty pop song called Starlight, we wanted to break into the charts, it's not very complicated and influenced.'. I hope I helped a bit. I'm not glad that someone should say something like that about Starlight. I get what you're saying, but... there has to be some truth to those statements. What, in particular, do you think is influenced by Italian/African etc. elements?
macgivera Posted January 26, 2011 Posted January 26, 2011 What, in particular, do you think is influenced by Italian/African etc. elements? The point is that nothing in particular is influenced by this. Matt said that to describe common theme of these songs, his thoughts. Italian ? 'the track sounds like a soundtrack to a spaghetti western' (KoC), Italian+Croatian+Turkish? 'Features an orchestral part written whilst the band resided in Italy. Has a mixed folk & Eastern sound.' (CoD). African ? Matt like to say a lot of things, he felt connection between Mexico, Italy and Africa and said that. Like I said, Exogenesis isn't 15 minute space rock solo but Matt said that. I think from interviews before releasing albums we can only have general image, for details we must wait for release.
haze015 Posted January 26, 2011 Posted January 26, 2011 I know it's probably a bad term; what I mean by it is 'Western' music (not the genre), the kind of melodies, or note scales, that are the norm in Europe and America. The reason I used 'Anglo' as a term was because I believe that Great Britain was the birthplace of modern music (almost all music we listen to is in English), even if the US has surpassed it. But hell, I'm not a historian... If you go to Turkey, for instance, and you will mostly hear local, Arabic-themed music. I know it's generalising, but I'm trying to put a finger on what I mean. Many places are entirely cut off from the kind of music we westerners listen to, and it's completely different. The USA was most definitely the birthplace of "modern" music and the industry as we know it today (Blues, Jazz & Rock'n'Roll), but the UK has been the birthplace of many different genres and still continuing to innovate (I wouldn't include Muse in that at all by the way), whereas the USA has stagnated and nothing majorly new since Hip Hop. But countries like Germany have also had a huge impact and many German bands have influenced many British bands. Post-punk & Synth Pop was music made by British musicians listening to German bands...
alehartl Posted January 27, 2011 Posted January 27, 2011 I think part of the problem, if you want to call it that, is that when Matt's claiming those things as influences (Croatian, Italian, African, whatever), it's basically what he'd been listening to. So, if he's listening to Croatian music and writes a song that is, in his mind, "influenced" by Croatian music it might not sound influence by anything unusual at all because influences don't always show up in someone's product in very tangible ways. Often times, an influence might just come through in a conveyed emotion or in a very small detail. A good example of this is Radiohead's "We Suck Young Blood," which is influenced by Charles Mingus' "Freedom." Listen to the Mingus tune first and then listen to the Radiohead song. The only thing that really makes its way from one to the other is the slow feel with the heavy clap on 4. Harmonically, they aren't really similar. Also, you have to keep in mind that Muse are and (hopefully) always will be a rock band, and to have exotic influences displayed very prominently would probably alienate the casual fan. It's all fine to have the surf-rock slide in KoC because we can all laugh about it and it's not that much of a stretch. On the other hand, if you have (Croatian/African/Martian/who gives a fuck) out there for everyone to see, eyebrows get raised and records aren't sold. Hope that was helpful.
alehartl Posted January 27, 2011 Posted January 27, 2011 whereas the USA has stagnated and nothing majorly new since Hip Hop. I take exception to that. We've brought shitty pop music to a fantastic to new level! ...seriously though, it's fucking terrible.
haze015 Posted January 27, 2011 Posted January 27, 2011 I take exception to that. We've brought shitty pop music to a fantastic to new level! ...seriously though, it's fucking terrible. Ever heard of PWL? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Waterman_Entertainment#Notable_former_PWL_artists Never realised 2 Unlimited were on PWL :LOL: Or ever watched the Eurovision Song Contest?
alehartl Posted January 27, 2011 Posted January 27, 2011 Ever heard of PWL? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Waterman_Entertainment#Notable_former_PWL_artists Never realised 2 Unlimited were on PWL :LOL: Or ever watched the Eurovision Song Contest? I've heard stories of Eurovision, that's about all I think I can stomach. I'm not denying the English's ability to make bad music, but I'd rather have Adele at the top of my charts than...(runs to check who's on top of the album charts this week)...Cake? Apparently Cake is at the top of the American album charts. Who knew?
Jetro Posted January 27, 2011 Author Posted January 27, 2011 The point is that nothing in particular is influenced by this. Matt said that to describe common theme of these songs, his thoughts. Italian ? 'the track sounds like a soundtrack to a spaghetti western' (KoC), Italian+Croatian+Turkish? 'Features an orchestral part written whilst the band resided in Italy. Has a mixed folk & Eastern sound.' (CoD). African ? Matt like to say a lot of things, he felt connection between Mexico, Italy and Africa and said that. Like I said, Exogenesis isn't 15 minute space rock solo but Matt said that. I think from interviews before releasing albums we can only have general image, for details we must wait for release. Ah, that clears things up. As for Exogenesis: It's only about 2 minutes short. And calling it 'space rock solo', well, okay. I guess I took things a bit too literal. Probably because the CoD, Voodoo and KoC match up so perfectly, and I got a bit hanged up there ... The USA was most definitely the birthplace of "modern" music and the industry as we know it today (Blues, Jazz & Rock'n'Roll), but the UK has been the birthplace of many different genres and still continuing to innovate(...) Right, I mean, UK was at least a springboard for pop music, and that's a huge genre. Good point about Germany though, I suppose eurotrash or something originated from there. Also: write da feem toon, sing da feem toon. It's all fine to have the surf-rock slide in KoC because we can all laugh about it and it's not that much of a stretch. On the other hand, if you have (Croatian/African/Martian/who gives a fuck) out there for everyone to see, eyebrows get raised and records aren't sold. Hope that was helpful. Right, so what about CoD? That sounds so very Spanish/Mexican. I love that song, and don't think it has alienated anyone. But yeah, your post cleared things up
jbyun04 Posted January 27, 2011 Posted January 27, 2011 Supermassive Black Hole had influence from Belgian music.. Evil Superstars and Millionaire. Ennio Morricone obviously had a big influence on KoC and CoD.
Anxyous Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Knights of Cydonia inspiration: Guess the name of the guitarist...
haze015 Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Knights of Cydonia inspiration: Guess the name of the guitarist... I already mentioned Joe Meek, who actually wrote & produced the song.
Anxyous Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 I already mentioned Joe Meek, who actually wrote & produced the song. I do apologise for stepping on your ego.
haze015 Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 I do apologise for stepping on your ego. Or you could try reading threads before posting.
Anxyous Posted February 6, 2011 Posted February 6, 2011 Or you could try reading threads before posting. Is it unthinkable that not every person in the world knows who Joe Meek is?
haze015 Posted February 6, 2011 Posted February 6, 2011 Is it unthinkable that not every person in the world knows who Joe Meek is? It was quite clear not everyone knows who he is, hence why I mentioned him and linked to his most famous song. I'm sure if people want to learn more about him, it is possible to research him on the internet. What are you trying to prove?
Anxyous Posted February 8, 2011 Posted February 8, 2011 It was quite clear not everyone knows who he is, hence why I mentioned him and linked to his most famous song. I'm sure if people want to learn more about him, it is possible to research him on the internet. What are you trying to prove? I'm not trying to prove anything, you just seemed cross and all "I was there first!" when I wrote my original post.
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